NewStats: 3,262,484 , 8,177,261 topics. Date: Monday, 02 June 2025 at 12:28 PM 10r1n

jl115:
What about Trump is rac1st? let's start there

his polices

andrewza:



Not rally. We want to have a northern European system but we don't have the cash flow they have. The ANC and even the SA for that matter are not Marxist. That is only the EFF and MK and both are minority parties.

the ANC is run by business people and is just your typical centre left party where the DA is a center right party. Both parties actually want south Africa to be closer to the Socialist European economy of the EU than the free market system f the USA. It why the ANC formed the GNU with the DA vs the EFF and MK.

Your post is full of contradiction, firstly how is the South African Communist Party NOT Marxist, its literally in the name. Also how can the DA be center right if it wants to be closer to a socialist European economy? In fact I slightly agree with this statement however the DA is 100% center left. The only relevant party that could be considered center right based on policy is the FF+

andrewza:



his polices

What policies are rac1st? name just one if you can.

For those who don't believe that western countries put family planning drugs in the African food system and even intentionally release diseases. This is some of the stuff they did during the cold war.

The us can't be trusted.

In the documents published on the Kennedy assassination, American journalist Ben Norton found a host of interesting things:

1. The CIA added poisonous substances to Cuban sugar sent to the USSR

2. The CIA poisoned cows in East Socialist to make the image of the "poor East and prosperous West" clearer, and also added soap to children's milk, blew up railways and carried out sabotage actions in factories.

This is how the secret services work. This is how they work now.

..

jl115:
At no point did I ‘justify’ AfriForum’s actions—I simply pointed out that their influence is irrelevant to the broader issue of South Africa’s reckless foreign policy. But instead of addressing that, you’ve resorted to emotional outbursts, strawman arguments, and logical fallacy.

Screaming ‘right-wing’ like it’s some magical counterpoint doesn’t change the reality: South Africa’s foreign policy blunders are self-inflicted. And if your best ‘solution’ is fantasizing about political executions, then maybe the real threat to democracy isn’t AfriForum, but the authoritarian mindset you and people like you are pushing.

My man, I would say you're a lost soul, however understanding the kind that groomed you, I am not surprised.

Stating "reasons" why AfriForum is out there pushing misinformation and propaganda is actually ing the very propaganda, if you were not THEN the reasons should have not mattered because you would have known their intentions......but I will assume you do, which is why you're working extra hard to spread it, like a true propaganda foot soldier.

A logical fallacy argument is what you have been engaged in the past week, shifting goal posts, attacking and using irrelevant points to look like you have an argument all in of your built-in Boer nationalist $h!t.

Young sir, there's only one problem in South Africa and it claims to be a victim of the post Apartheid South Africa.

GreenandGold:


My man, I would say you're a lost soul, however understanding the kind that groomed you, I am not surprised.

Stating "reasons" why AfriForum is out there pushing misinformation and propaganda is actually ing the very propaganda, if you were not THEN the reasons should have not mattered because you would have known their intentions......but I will assume you do, which is why you're working extra hard to spread it, like a true propaganda foot soldier.

A logical fallacy argument is what you have been engaged in the past week, shifting goal posts, attacking and using irrelevant points to look like you have an argument all in of your built-in Boer nationalist $h!t.

Young sir, there's only one problem in South Africa and it claims to be a victim of the post Apartheid South Africa.

For over a decade, I’ve defended, promoted and ed my country on thus forum—not any group, not any party, but South Africa itself. Meanwhile, you’ve twisted basic debate into an exercise in bad-faith attacks and outright fabrications because you can’t engage with the points I’ve made. So, let’s break down your nonsense piece by piece.

1. “I would say you’re a lost soul, however understanding the kind that groomed you, I am not surprised.”

Ah, the classic genetic fallacy—discrediting an argument based on its supposed origins rather than addressing its substance. Instead of engaging with anything I’ve said, you’re implying that my views are the product of “grooming” by some unnamed “kind,” as if I lack the ability to think for myself. It’s lazy, and it’s not an argument

2. “Stating ‘reasons’ why AfriForum is out there pushing misinformation and propaganda is actually ing the very propaganda.”

So, according to you, merely analyzing AfriForum’s influence and acknowledging why they lobbied in the U.S. somehow means I’m promoting their propaganda? That’s a blatant false dilemma—either I ignore reality, or I’m part of some grand conspiracy. Sorry, but that’s not how logic works.


3. “If you were not [ing them], then the reasons should have not mattered because you would have known their intentions.”

This is an absurd non sequitur. Understanding why someone does something isn’t the same as ing them. If that were the case, historians explaining why Nazi invaded Poland would automatically be Nazi sympathizers. Your reasoning is embarrassingly shallow.


4. “A logical fallacy argument is what you have been engaged in the past week, shifting goal posts, attacking and using irrelevant points to look like you have an argument all in of your built-in Boer nationalist $h!t.”

Projection much? You’re the one who ignored my points about South Africa’s reckless foreign policy, avoided my argument that we should prioritize fixing our country before trying to act as a global moral authority, and shifted the entire discussion to some AfriForum rant instead. And now you’re using guilt by association and ad hominem to avoid actually debating the topic.


5. “Young sir, there's only one problem in South Africa and it claims to be a victim of the post-Apartheid South Africa.”

So, according to you, corruption, crime, failing infrastructure, load shedding, economic decline, and geopolitical incompetence aren’t real problems—the only issue is a specific demographic that you personally despise? That’s not analysis; that’s pure ideological fanaticism.

You’ve made it clear that facts don’t interest you, logic doesn’t interest you, and debate certainly doesn’t interest you. Your entire argument consists of deflection, emotional outbursts, and labeling anyone who disagrees with you as a “propagandist” or a “Boer nationalist.” That’s not an argument—that’s the tactic of someone who has already lost the debate and knows it.

GreenandGold:



Pis-s off you say? You haven't been paying attention, clown. 🤡

Politicians smile all the time in these kinds of visits. That doesn't make you allies. Are the guys below allies?

In fact, you may have completely missed the point. As far as the norm is, to be assertive on foreign policy, as SA wants to be. You should have a foreign policy that has some meaning to it. Your government wants to be Democratic and anti-western at the same time. Pan-african and nationalist at the same time. While it isn't strange to be centrist and ambigous, pursuing both ends aggressively is self-confusion.

GreenandGold:


clown. 🤡

You may not realize it but the fact that you felt an overwhelming need to add this, says A LOT about the kind of person you're very likely to be.

You aren't even among those I frequently disagree with, yet on your first response, you felt this was appropriate.

Baller254:
I realized long ago Trump/musk haters have common sense problem, emotional issues and are victims of liberal propaganda and brainwashing. The kind that will attacks and violence against opposing opinions, weak borders and immigration, gender confused men in women's spaces, dumb economic policies that doesn't benefit it's own nations, virtue signaling with nice words while doing the exact opposite...etc(the list is too long)
Trump is blunt and real, his intentions are clear not masked in niceties like the modern day leftists who are truly the evil ones.
a politician who actually did what he promised.

GabrielYulaw:


Trump IS a racist, conman, raapist, adulterer, m0ron and more. Saying the truth no be crime. Man was best buddies with Epstein and on Reddit and Quora, you will easily find tales of how he conned carpenters and others who worked in building and renovating his houses/hotels out of their money. Some of these workmen died bankrupt, because Donnie the bonespur fcvker doesn't pay his bills.

jl115:
What about Trump is rac1st? let's start there

Please let's try as much as possible not to debate Western left wing / right wing politics here. Eventually It will take this thread completely off the tracks. Not forgetting that it is very divisive.

Faithful007:


Politicians smile all the time in these kinds of visits. That doesn't make you allies. Are the guys below allies?

In fact, you may have completely missed the point. As far as the norm is, to be assertive on foreign policy, as SA wants to be. You should have a foreign policy that has some meaning to it. Your government wants to be Democratic and anti-western at the same time. Pan-african and nationalist at the same time. While it isn't strange to be centrist and ambigous, pursuing both ends aggressively is self-confusion.

It's 2025, the term "ally" means nothing, every country promotes it's own interests in the international stage, relationships will be sacrificed when they longer serve a purpose. Take a look at Canada, an American ally for over a century, today they're ridiculed, sovereignty threatened by the current US istration for a circus agenda. They don't even a meaningful military diterant should their southern borders be threatened because they never thought their age-old ally would behave in a current manner.

South Africa has no ally in the true term of the word, same as Nigeria or any African country, in fact no country in the world has an ally besides Israel who's Jewish population pays money to keep the Israeli agenda on the table and sublime threatens any US president or member of Congress who question it.

So bro, every country puts it's self's interests above all, our interests will forever change based on the politics of the day, same as every country's.

Faithful007:


You may not realize it but the fact that you felt an overwhelming need to add this, says A LOT about the kind of person you're very likely to be.

You aren't even among those I frequently disagree with, yet on your first response, you felt this was appropriate.

I will apologise, consider it my bad.

Faithful007:






Please let's try as much as possible not to debate Western left wing / right wing politics here. Eventually It will take this thread completely off the tracks. Not forgetting that it is very divisive.

fair point!!

jl115:
Your post is full of contradiction, firstly how is the South African Communist Party NOT Marxist, its literally in the name. Also how can the DA be center right if it wants to be closer to a socialist European economy? In fact I slightly agree with this statement however the DA is 100% center left. The only relevant party that could be considered center right based on policy is the FF+

you do know that not all comunist movements are the same and just because they have communist in the name does not make them comunist. are you saying the C is a marxist group.

Europe is center-right for the most part. or at least closer to the center than they are to the extreme.

FF+ are indeed right wing but all so pretty small.

jl115:
What policies are rac1st? name just one if you can.

he signed a order to have white afrikans farmers be dcleaed refugees. Ignoring that there are other groups that farm in south Africa that suffer far more. This is a clear racist act

Baller254:
I realized long ago Trump/musk haters have common sense problem, emotional issues and are victims of liberal propaganda and brainwashing. The kind that will attacks and violence against opposing opinions, weak borders and immigration, gender confused men in women's spaces, dumb economic policies that doesn't benefit it's own nations, virtue signaling with nice words while doing the exact opposite...etc(the list is too long)
Trump is blunt and real, his intentions are clear not masked in niceties like the modern day leftists who are truly the evil ones.
a politician who actually did what he promised.

I hate both for very different reasons and hated them when they where still shilling for the Democrats.

It’s crazy how there’s a Balkan esc war going on in Africa and The East African Community is essentially at war between it’s . How is little o’l Rwanda setting off fire crackers right in the center of the neighborhood committee so freely? Not to mention the possibility of another South Sudan civil war breaking out.

I only a few years ago when this was speculated to happen in the ECOWAS neighborhood because of the junta alliance which has moderately calmed down the past year.

The EAC never should have expanded.

AskiaHarem:
It’s crazy how there’s a Balkan esc war going on in Africa and The East African Community is essentially at war between it’s . How is little o’l Rwanda setting off fire crackers right in the center of the neighborhood committee so freely? Not to mention the possibility of another South Sudan civil war breaking out.

I only a few years ago when this was speculated to happen in the ECOWAS neighborhood because of the junta alliance which has moderately calmed down the past year.

The EAC never should have expanded.

I would say that the M23 is an arm of the Rwandan military at this point. In of training and equipment, they so linked to Rwanda that they could be a branch of the RDF.

I think the fighting that took place was complicated and that without Rwandan , the M23 would have failed in their attack. I don't think it matters if the soldiers that attacked the SADC forces were the Rwanan army or M23 at this point.


All so I agree Rwanda should be suspended.

jl115:
What about Trump is rac1st? let's start there

This is definitely not ordinary

Baller254:
I realized long ago Trump/musk haters have common sense problem, emotional issues and are victims of liberal propaganda and brainwashing. The kind that will attacks and violence against opposing opinions, weak borders and immigration, gender confused men in women's spaces, dumb economic policies that doesn't benefit it's own nations, virtue signaling with nice words while doing the exact opposite...etc(the list is too long)
Trump is blunt and real, his intentions are clear not masked in niceties like the modern day leftists who are truly the evil ones.
a politician who actually did what he promised.

Kenyans takes must always be odd.

andrewza:


you do know that not all comunist movements are the same and just because they have communist in the name does not make them comunist. are you saying the C is a marxist group.

Europe is center-right for the most part. or at least closer to the center than they are to the extreme.

FF+ are indeed right wing but all so pretty small.

the C literally calls itself Marxist in its constitution bru so yeah they are Marxist.

Europe is moving towards
more center right but certainly aren't there yet at best they are center leaning

FF+ is center right not right wing, policy wise

andrewza:


he signed a order to have white afrikans farmers be dcleaed refugees. Ignoring that there are other groups that farm in south Africa that suffer far more. This is a clear racist act

It’s not racist—refugee status is about perceived persecution, not race. Afrikaner farmers were granted it due to perceived targeted farm attacks and land policies, not because they’re white.

Saying “others have it worse” misses the point—refugee status isn’t a competition. Many groups get asylum for specific threats (Yazidis, Rohingya, Soviet Jews). Were those racist?

QuietMynd:

This is definitely not ordinary

what do you mean?

Guys, you've had 4 pages. I suggest you start a new thread and continue the debate there; this thread can then go back on-topic.

jl115:
the C literally calls itself Marxist in its constitution bru so yeah they are Marxist.

Europe is moving towards
more center right but certainly aren't there yet at best they are center leaning

FF+ is center right not right wing, policy wise

if a man calls him self a women is it a he or she?

Shameless self-promotion:

Our Mergers & Acquisitions division worked on Vox Ventures' acquisition of Robertson & Caine, now South Africa's largest boat builder manufacturing for export, the largest builder of catamarans in the Southern Hemisphere and the third-largest globally. They also manufacture the most power catamarans, globally. Their sailing and power catamarans can be found berthed in such different locales as the US East Coast, SA, the Caribbean, Mauritius, Isle de Reunion, Seychelles, Mediterranean, Asia, South Pacific and South America.

This shipment of Leopard Catamarans is bound for the Med. Previously, Cape Town's professional sailors and crew would make a decent living delivering these by sailing them up the Red Sea into the Suez. The Houthis put a stop to that. Only the cross-Atlantic and Asian-bound craft are still sailed to their destinations.

It's a pity, as that always served as the ultimate sea trial for owners.
1/...

...last.

andrewza:


if a man calls him self a women is it a he or she?

Ok so C isn't marxist even though they say they are marxist and are communist.....some logic their bru

andrewza:



I would say that the M23 is an arm of the Rwandan military at this point. In of training and equipment, they so linked to Rwanda that they could be a branch of the RDF.

I think the fighting that took place was complicated and that without Rwandan , the M23 would have failed in their attack. I don't think it matters if the soldiers that attacked the SADC forces were the Rwanan army or M23 at this point.


All so I agree Rwanda should be suspended.

What do you think on the full inclusion of South Sudan, Somalia, and D. Congo to the block? Where do you see the future going?

please explain why Trump is kicking out black and brown refugees out of the US, even those that's been given temporary status by the previous istration, and want them deported, yet he went out of his way to encourage white south Africans to move into the US, not like they were starving in SA or anything like that, I'm sure there are more vulnerable groups in Africa who aren't white and in dire need for such gesture.
Why kick out over half a million non-white people, only to ask whites from outside to move in?
Or when he referred to African countries and others as sh!t hole countries, while once again going out of his way trying to encourage people from Switzerland etc to move to the US.
He is a racist. No maybe.
This is the same guy who refused to rent apartments to black people right here in nyc.
Not to mention his newspaper ads for reinstatement of the death penalty against five black teenagers, also called the central park 5 case in 1989, he placed ads on several newspapers for this.
All 5 were later exonerated.
he of course want them put to death.

jl115:

It’s not racist—refugee status is about perceived persecution, not race. Afrikaner farmers were granted it due to perceived targeted farm attacks and land policies, not because they’re white.

Saying “others have it worse” misses the point—refugee status isn’t a competition. Many groups get asylum for specific threats (Yazidis, Rohingya, Soviet Jews). Were those racist?