NewStats: 3,261,909 , 8,175,512 topics. Date: Saturday, 31 May 2025 at 12:16 AM j5927

The Almighty God has given mankind all what we need to enjoy life on planet earth but after the fall of mankind in the garden of Eden a lot has happened that requires the intervention of God because Satan and his cohorts (demons) have seized the opportunity to live and rule among humans therefore with their presence only God's intervention can the righteous survive.
Satan and demons are ing what they initiated with supernatural powers.
For instance there was no record of any miracles when Adam and Eve started as a couple but Satan used a snake as puppet to speak with Eve.
You can imagine the thoughts running in the mind of this woman as she heard an animal speak to her for the first time ever. She would start doubting what God told her and her husband:

“Be fruitful and become many, fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving on the earth.”

Please how can the couple truly have in subjection a creature that's wiser than them?

Who will tell Eve that what just happened has the backing of a supernatural force that's opposed to their life giver?

That's the first miracle ever happened in the face of Eve so when God's word said the woman was thoroughly deceived {1Timothy 2:14} we can grasp what really happened because Adam can't be fooled with miracles.
Why?
Because he knew how God miraculously created Eve using his rib and he himself spoke of it when he said:

“This is at last bone of my bones And flesh of my flesh. This one will be called Woman, Because from man she was taken" Genesis 2:23

The introduction of miracles to deceive humans first came from Satan {Revelations 12:7} that's why God must intervene otherwise the righteous can't survive with Satan and demons living on this planet with humans!

To be continued....

Adam put the blame on God instead of itting his blunder so God perform a miracle for the first time in the face of this couple, He made a cloth for them using animal skin then two angels from nowhere appeared with a sword turning itself speedily while the angels keep following Adam and Eve until both of them left the garden of Eden and the two angels with the turning sword in the middle stopped at the gate of Eden so that the couple had no further access into the garden!
When Adam and Eve began having children their children, grandchildren and great grandchildren were seeing the garden with the two angels and that turning sword in between stationed at the gate of the garden until the flood swept everything away.
So only Noah's children could tell their own generation about the garden and the two angels guarding the gate to Eden.
God has performed many more miracles to save His worshipers from the hands of Satan, demons and their human agents that's why miracles do happen not that we can just call God to start displaying His powers when it's not necessary.
In our modern times there are miracles that Jehovah performed in behalf of His Organized worshipers and just as it has always been such events are known only among His worshipers.
Jehovah is doing a lot today that makes us marvel He is like telling us:
"I am with you so you need not fear anyone" Isaiah 41:10
Many sceptics do anticipate miracles saying God should use it to convince them of His existence but has God ever done such just for spectacular display in time past?
Well let the Bible God's word enlighten us.
To be continued....

MaxInDHouse:
In our modern times there are miracles that Jehovah performed in behalf of His Organized worshipers and just as it has always been such events are known only among His worshipers.
Jehovah is doing a lot today that makes us marvel He is like telling us:

Is this a New Light? You have claimed here severally that the era of miracles are gone with the apostles

MightySparrow:

Is this a New Light? You have claimed here severally that the era of miracles are gone with the apostles

Of course Jehovah doesn't give anyone such power today that doesn't mean Jehovah has stopped doing the needful when necessary.
So try to get the sense of what someone says not just running to a wrong conclusion and speculating what you never heard them say.

MaxInDHouse:

Of course Jehovah doesn't give anyone such power today that doesn't mean Jehovah has stopped doing the needful when necessary.
So try to get the sense of what someone says not just running to a wrong conclusion and speculating what you never heard them say.

Which power?

MightySparrow:

Which power?

Power to perform miracles!

After the time of Moses from generation to generation only few Israelites witnessed miracles they only read what God did in the past and since those involved are people they can trace their lineage they believe yet some sceptics among them insists God must continue using His servants to perform miracles that they read about in the scriptures.
For instance the Jews in Jeremiah's day felt he's just making noise as he couldn't perform any signs like those they have heard in times past, so many other prophets also never performed any signs including John the baptist so when Jesus the prophet they've read about in the Bible that will come in the manner of Moses arrived faithless Jews were totally annoyed with him as he refused to perform miracles that fits their expectations.
Jesus told them that he only performs miracles according to needs not just because some people demands for it as sign from heaven! Matthew 16:4

So what is the purpose of miracles if not for spectacular display or demands?

To be continued...

MaxInDHouse:

Power to perform miracles!

Which miracles happen in your organization?

MightySparrow:

Which miracles happen in your organization?

A lot that we can't count but since we don't orchestrate it we can't invite you to come and witness what we're not the ones doing it.
There's one i can never forget.
A brother born with curved (bow) legs grew up and because of his love for Jehovah he decided to become a regular pioneer (JWs that spends more time in preaching and teaching)
Unfortunately he had a serious injury that worsen the condition of his legs but did he stop pioneering?
No! Instead he decided to partner with other pioneers so that when anyone is free he can work with them in the field.
Then one day while they were in the field a drunk driver was heading the way of these pioneers and as he almost run over them they all jumped a big gutter living this brother behind, he also tried but fell right inside the gutter, everyone was scared that the legs are gone.
But by the time our brother came out of the gutters the bow leg suddenly became straight in fact he was walking as if nothing happened then all of them shouted his name then he looked back and asked "wetin happen nah, i no wound jọọ let's go" but they all stood still looking at his legs that's when a little girl among them shouted
"brother, what happened to your legs!"
That's when he himself realized that his legs is no longer curved or injured but straightened like everyone else.
That was the end of their preaching that day as all of them returned home thinking about what really happened.
Many of such events do happen but since it's not within our power to say what Jehovah will do we can't invite you to come and witness what we never arranged.

MaxInDHouse:

A lot that we can't count but since we don't orchestrate it we can't invite you to come and witness what we're not the ones doing it.
There's one i can never forget.
A brother born with curved (bow) legs grew up and because of his love for Jehovah he decided to become a regular pioneer (JWs that spends more time in preaching and teaching)
Unfortunately he had a serious injury that worsen the condition of his legs but did he stop pioneering?
No! Instead he decided to partner with other pioneers so that when anyone is free he can work with them in the field.
Then one day while they were in the field a drunk driver was heading the way of these pioneers and as he almost run over them they all jumped a big gutter living this brother behind, he also tried but fell right inside the gutter, everyone was scared that the legs are gone.
But by the time our brother came out of the gutters the bow leg suddenly became straight in fact he was walking as if nothing happened then all of them shouted his name then he looked back and asked "wetin happen nah, i no wound jọọ let's go" but they all stood still looking at his legs that's when a little girl among them shouted
"brother, what happened to your legs!"
That's when he himself realized that his legs is no longer curved or injured but straightened like everyone else.
That was the end of their preaching that day as all of them returned home thinking about what really happened.
Many of such events do happen but since it's not within our power to say what Jehovah will do we can't invite you to come and witness what we never arranged.

Good, but all this time , you have claimed that God is on holiday in your organization. This kind of miracles I enjoy regularly in my life, every time.

One more thing, apart from this accidental miracle, can you ask God to do it for you in case you need one?

MightySparrow:

Good, but all this time , you have claimed that God is on holiday in your organization. This kind of miracles I enjoy regularly in my life, every time.
One more thing, apart from this accidental miracle, can you ask God to do it for you in case you need one?

You often misconstrue my posts what i keep saying is
"God doesn't give anyone the power to perform miracles again"
How does that translate to God has stopped working?

Of course we can't tell Jehovah what to do we only pray for His help, and protection as for how He's going to do that we leave everything in His hands we believe He knows best! Luke 22:42

MaxInDHouse:

You often misconstrue my posts what i keep saying is
"God doesn't give anyone the power to perform miracles again"
How does that translate to God has stopped working?

Of course we can't tell Jehovah what to do we only pray for His help, and protection as for how He's going to do that we leave everything in His hands we believe He knows best! Luke 22:42

J want to believe that when you say 'we', you are referring to the people in your organization only. In my own organization, we pray individually and collectively, and our own Jehovah answers us. I think your own Jehovah turns down your prayers because of your special relationship with him.

MightySparrow:

J want to believe that when you say 'we', you are referring to the people in your organization only. In my own organization, we pray individually and collectively, and our own Jehovah answers us. I think your own Jehovah turns down your prayers because of your special relationship with him.

There you go again!
When i say "WE" i'm speaking about the faith of an organized people {John 17:20-23} even Jesus never ask for miracles to solve his personal problems rather he does Jehovah's will. Matthew 4:3-4

Do you have a special relationship with God than Jesus who will never use that privilege for personal use?

MaxInDHouse:

There you go again!
When i say "WE" i'm speaking about the faith of an organized people {John 17:20-23} even Jesus never ask for miracles to solve his personal problems rather he does Jehovah's. Matthew 4:3-4

Do you have a special relationship with God than Jesus who will never use the opportunity for personal gain?

Jesus didn't use the gifts for personal gain? Interesting.
Why were multitudes following him and used the opportunity to teach and preach to them? He used the gifts to fulfill his mission.

1Cor.12.1 - Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
1Cor.12.6 - And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
1Cor.12.7 - But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

So, when I am sick or any loved one is sick I pray for them, they see the power of my God. It is a profit for me and The Kingdom of God.

MightySparrow:


Jesus didn't use the gifts for personal gain? Interesting.
Why were multitudes following him and used the opportunity to teach and preach to them? He used the gifts to fulfill his mission.

1Cor.12.1 - Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
1Cor.12.6 - And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
1Cor.12.7 - But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

So, when I am sick or any loved one is sick I pray for them, they see the power of my God. It is a profit for me and The Kingdom of God.

You keep misconstruing everything but it's OK if you have the power to heal people continue.

MaxInDHouse:


You keep misconstruing everything but it's OK if you have the power to heal people continue.

MaxInDHouse:
. Then one day while they were in the field a drunk driver was heading the way of these pioneers and as he almost run over them they all jumped a big gutter living this brother behind, he also tried but fell right inside the gutter, everyone was scared that the legs are gone.
But by the time our brother came out of the gutters the bow leg suddenly became straight in fact he was walking as if nothing happened then all of them shouted his name then he looked back and asked "wetin happen nah, i no wound jọọ let's go" but they all stood still looking at his legs that's when a little girl among them shouted
"brother, what happened to your legs!" undecided
That's when he himself realized that his legs is no longer curved or injured but straightened like everyone else.

By your own testimony, God was drawing your attention like Moses in the wilderness. His encounter was accidental, he turned to see the sight. That became the beginning of his encounters. But now, you have shielded yourself from the reality of God's power by your 'special' knowledge of the scriptures.

Rom.10.3 - For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

MightySparrow:





By your own testimony, God was drawing your attention like Moses in the wilderness. His encounter was accidental, he turned to see the sight. That became the beginning of his encounters. But now, you have shielded yourself from the reality of God's power by your 'special' knowledge of the scriptures.

Rom.10.3 - For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Did all worshipers of God had the same experience?
Why did God call Moses and not all the Israelites?
The verse you quoted means each of them wants to establish his own righteousness just as most churchians today they refused to SUBMIT to God's righteousness.
First century Christians all SUBMITTED to the teachings of one group! Act 2:42
Please can you present a group with whom you SUBMIT to the same line of thought? John 17:22; 1Corinthans 1:10

That's the import of Romans 10:2-3

MaxInDHouse:


Did all worshipers of God had the same experience?
Why did God call Moses and not all the Israelites?
The verse you quoted means each of them wants to establish his own righteousness just as most churchians today they refused to SUBMIT to God's righteousness.
First century Christians all SUBMITTED to the teachings of one group! Act 2:42
Please can you present a group with whom you SUBMIT to the same line of thought? John 17:22; 1Corinthans 1:10

That's the import of Romans 10:2-3

MaxInDHouse:
Did all worshipers of God had the same experience?

They didn't need to have the same experience. Rejection of the experience is the problem here. Your organization shutting you people out by interpretations that are against God: an organization against God and His manifestations.
.
1Cor.12.6 - And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.

MightySparrow:

They didn't need to have the same experience. Rejection of the experience is the problem here. Your organization shutting you people out by interpretations that are against God: an organization against God and His manifestations.
.1Cor.12.6 - And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.

What God's organization is saying has been written in God's word in the first century:


Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. ‭1Corinthians 13:8-10 NIV‬


So we are taught to believe what is found written in God's word, miracles in the hands of humans have ceased in the first century therefore God only does His works without putting the power in the hands of any human.


That's what we believe!

MaxInDHouse:


What God's organization is saying has been written in God's word in the first century:


Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. ‭1Corinthians 13:8-10 NIV‬


So we are taught to believe what is found written in God's word, miracles in the hands of humans have ceased in the first century therefore God only does His works without putting the power in the hands of any human.


That's what we believe!

What is written or your own interpretation? Old light?

MightySparrow:

What is written or your own interpretation? Old light?

Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. ‭1Corinthians 13:8-10 NIV‬

That's the scripture interpret to the best of your knowledge and apply it nobody stops you from doing that.

So today many still anticipate miracles in the hands of humans due to their selfish cravings they just want God to do what they want and this has led them into false religions operated by false prophets who keeps extorting money from them since they don't want truth.

In the first century Jesus told the Jews who had such attitude that it's totally out of place for anyone to keep anticipating what God never promised instead they should focus on fulfillment of prophecies that's unfolding through his ministry.

For instance John the baptist anticipated a miracle from Jesus, he was arrested for speaking against politicians and that led to his been kept in detention so John expected Jesus to come and release him after all it's just the two of them doing God's work as prophets in the first century {Matthew 11:2-3} but Jesus sent a message back to John saying he is doing exactly what he supposed to do and John should be careful not to become stumbled due to wrong expectations! Matthew 11:4-6
John was beheaded in detention but what did Jesus say about John?
Jesus declared to his listeners that there has never been any prophet greater than John the baptist {Matthew 11:11} this shows that even righteous servants of God may have wrong expectations and surely such will affect their interpretations of God's word.
We can imagine the side effects of John's teachings regarding what Christ will do as most of his disciples were expecting a total change of power after recognizing Jesus as the Christ, in fact many of them wanted to force him as king in Jerusalem {John 6:15} after all that's what all the prophets (including John) said he will become {Isaiah 9:6-7 compare to John 1:26-27} so they were all anticipating great things to happen in the first century through the hands of Jesus only for him to stick to what he was sent to do at that particular time.
He told his listeners:
"I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative. Just as I hear, I judge, and my judgment is righteous because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him who sent me." John 5:30 this means even though going by human thinking there are things we could expect someone with such gifts to do but he is doing just as he was told no addition no subtraction!
So Jesus though the greatest miracle worker is strictly following a program as planned by someone greater than him he wasn't just doing what he feels is good according to his own perspective.

To be continued...

MaxInDHouse:


Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. ‭1Corinthians 13:8-10 NIV‬

That's the scripture interpret to the best of your knowledge and apply it nobody stops you from doing that.

The subject is not love but miracles, it is your own topic nah!

MightySparrow:

The subject is not love but miracles, it is your own topic nah!

Paul told us how to distinguish between false prophets and true Christians real believers aren't bothered about miracles rather what we focus on is love that Jesus said will serve as the mark of our identity as his true disciples {John 13:34-35} so any church performing miracles, speaking in tongues, seeing visions and other gifts but love eludes their gathering has nothing to do with faith in Christ Jesus because it's love that Jesus said can't be found in false religions as for supernatural gifts they will be found since demons (powerful fallen angels) are ing false religions! Matthew 7:21-23

That's the import of Paul's letter to the Corinthians.

MaxInDHouse:


Paul told us how to distinguish between false prophets and true Christians real believers aren't bothered about miracles rather what we focus on is love that Jesus said will serve as the mark of our identity as his true disciples {John 13:34-35} so any church performing miracles, speaking in tongues, seeing visions and other gifts but love eludes their gathering has nothing to do with faith in Christ Jesus because it's love that Jesus said can't be found in false religions as for supernatural gifts they will be found since demons (powerful fallen angels) are ing false religions! Matthew 7:21-23

That's the import of Paul's letter to the Corinthians.

Neither did Paul condemn miracles, wherever there are real objects shadows will be available.
Paul emphasis are on both and are related.

MightySparrow:

Neither did Paul condemn miracles, wherever there are real objects shadows will be available. Paul emphasis are on both and are related.

Nobody condemns miracles, what we are saying is there is a time it will stop in the hands of humans.
That's why Paul himself told Timothy to go using medicine when this believers was sick instead of miraculous healing:

Do not drink water any longer, but take a little wine for the sake of your stomach and your frequent cases of sickness. 1Timothy 5:23

Why didn't apostle Paul heal Timothy in a miraculous way?

It's because by that time miraculous healings has stopped occuring from the hands of humans! 1Corinthians 13:8-10

MaxInDHouse:


Nobody condemns miracles, what we are saying is there is a time it will stop in the hands of humans.
That's why Paul himself told Timothy to go using medicine when this believers was sick instead of miraculous healing:

Do not drink water any longer, but take a little wine for the sake of your stomach and your frequent cases of sickness. 1Timothy 5:23

Why didn't apostle Paul heal Timothy in a miraculous way?

It's because by that time miraculous healings has stopped occuring from the hands of humans! 1Corinthians 13:8-10

Lie Sir. Paul saw a crippled that had faith to be healed, with one word, he was healed. Jesus went to his hometown and because of unbelief ( the kind you are touting here now), only few were healed. It is all depends on faith not faithlessness you teach. Timothy may not have the faith to be healed.
The scriptures say, I am the Lord, I change not....'. Your organization says, ' he is an ever changing Lord of New Lights'.

MightySparrow:

Lie Sir. Paul saw a crippled that had faith to be healed, with one word, he was healed. Jesus went to his hometown and because of unbelief ( the kind you are touting here now), only few were healed. It is all depends on faith not faithlessness you teach. Timothy may not have the faith to be healed.
The scriptures say, I am the Lord, I change not....'. Your organization says, ' he is an ever changing Lord of New Lights'.

You don't get it CHRISTIANITY was born that time like a new born baby {1Corinthans 13:11} so all the signs was to help the Jews and Judaists all over the world back then that God is no longer backing Judaism but a newly born religion in the name of CHRISTIANITY.

That's why the signs began cooling off immediately after Christianity has spread to all the nations around Mediterranean sea because that's where Judaists were living back then and it's purposely because of them that God put the power in the hands of Christians in the first century.

By the time Paul wrote that letter to Timothy it's over 30 years after Jesus' ascension that's why Paul couldn't perform miracles to heal Timothy {1Timothy 5:23} neither was he able to heal himself from his own sickness! 2Corinthians 12:7

You can't beat the truth no matter how you wish there is no one given power to perform miracles again after the first century disciples of Christ stopped performing miracles.

[Equote author=MaxInDHouse post=134924170]You don't get it CHRISTIANITY was born that time like a new born baby {1Corinthans 13:11} so all the signs was to help the Jews and Judaists all over the world back then that God is no longer backing Judaism but a newly born religion in the name of CHRISTIANITY.

That's why the signs began cooling off immediately after Christianity has spread to all the nations around Mediterranean sea because that's where Judaists were living back then and it's purposely because of them that God put the power in the hands of Christians in the first century.

By the time Paul wrote that letter to Timothy it's over 30 years after Jesus' ascension that's why Paul couldn't perform miracles to heal Timothy {1Timothy 5:23} neither was he able to heal himself from his own sickness! 2Corinthians 12:7

You can't beat the truth no matter how you wish there is no one given power to perform miracles again after the first century disciples of Christ stopped performing miracles[/quote]

What you are saying is community truth. Elisha still died of sickness. The gift doesn't not depend on persons. Paul and Timothy were just ministers. Each still have to exercise his own faith.
Romans 1: 17; Gal. 3: 11; He. 10:38.
I don't agree with your interpretation. I have evidence, you have argument. Mine was not accidental but repeatable.
Your own faithlessness is also against the Lord is evidently repeatable.
Your own truths are manifestations of God's power.
I can't deny what I have experienced.
2Pet.1.16 - For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

If I now or countless others abandon their clarity for your theories, that would be high level of stupidity.

MightySparrow:

What you are saying is community truth. Elisha still died of sickness. The gift doesn't not depend on persons. Paul and Timothy were just ministers. Each still have to exercise his own faith.
Romans 1: 17; Gal. 3: 11; He. 10:38.
I don't agree with your interpretation. I have evidence, you have argument. Mine was not accidental but repeatable.
Your own faithlessness is also against the evidently repeatable.
Your own truths are manifestations of God's power.
I can't deny what I have experienced.
2Pet.1.16 - For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

If I now or countless others abandon their clarity for your theories, that would be high level of stupidity.

Do prophet always perform miracles?

MaxInDHouse:


You don't get it CHRISTIANITY was born that time like a new born baby {1Corinthans 13:11} so all the signs was to help the Jews and Judaists all over the world back then that God is no longer backing Judaism but a newly born religion in the name of CHRISTIANITY.

That's why the signs began cooling off immediately after Christianity has spread to all the nations around Mediterranean sea because that's where Judaists were living back then and it's purposely because of them that God put the power in the hands of Christians in the first century.

By the time Paul wrote that letter to Timothy it's over 30 years after Jesus' ascension that's why Paul couldn't perform miracles to heal Timothy {1Timothy 5:23} neither was he able to heal himself from his own sickness! 2Corinthians 12:7

You can't beat the truth no matter how you wish there is no one given power to perform miracles again after the first century disciples of Christ stopped performing miracles.

God is the same today, yesterday and forevermore!

You saying he doesn't give such power is FALSE! Which bears remarkable resemblance to the Islamic narrative of "seals". They claim Muhammad was the last of prophets and you claim the disciples were the last miracle workers!

You lots both limited God by your understanding! —Muslims😵‍💫 and JW🤕!

MaxInDHouse:


Do prophet always perform miracles?

No.

It doesn't take a prophet to perform a miracle.