NewStats: 3,263,906 , 8,181,831 topics. Date: Sunday, 08 June 2025 at 05:32 PM 6i5x3k

TransAtlanticEx:
You see that bolded ehn,roll weed,read am again and see how it sounds
TB at 18% is a means of clearing up free naira in the hands of future speculators.
That person who is buying fx with 1.8m would have bought it with the whole 10m if TBs was not at 18%.
And of course 10m will definitely exert more pressure than 1.8m
Now that TB is low,nobody will want to block 10m for 94k PA,rather there would be so much liquidity now for speculative purposes since the debt market has crashed.
What are you saying bros?

You're right in thinking low yields portends the risk of making the 10m available to chase FX. However it's only a risk that may end up not materialsing.

That was why we didn't go from 13% to 0.9% at once.

We knew of this risk, and we crashed gradually watching how things would turn out. Apparently, the risk you mentioned which I also know to be accurate, didn't materialize. There were still oversubscriptions. I agree with you the over subscriptions were mostly institutional.

At the retail segment also, funds from T-bills didn't mostly go into chasing or stashing FX.
Folks mostly redeployed to Bonds, mutual funds, equities and properties.

So your point is only a possibility. we watched and it didn't materialize.

On the other hand, continuing with a interest rate regime was not a possibility, it was a certainty.


I mean when you discount 20trn worth of instruments at 20%, You've CERTAINLY created 4trn new naira on a constant FX position.

If you had $40bn in reserves, each dollar in your reserves would #500 for 20trn.

But when you increase your naira position to 24trn via high interests, each dollar would then be able to #600.

Now, that's the guaranteed devaluation that we have avoided through low rates.

Lazyyouth4u:

Do you know how health insurance works? Perhaps you should go and read up on that first. Contributions for health insurance is different from taxes my friend.

I think you're letting the fact that the suggestion came from Ahib cloud your appraisal of it.

People get taxed, or put another way, they are made to contribute towards their road
maintenance each time they buy fuel into their cars. How much different is that from Ahib's suggestion?

TransAtlanticEx:
You see that bolded ehn,roll weed,read am again and see how it sounds
TB at 18% is a means of clearing up free naira in the hands of future speculators.
That person who is buying fx with 1.8m would have bought it with the whole 10m if TBs was not at 18%.
And of course 10m will definitely exert more pressure than 1.8m
Now that TB is low,nobody will want to block 10m for 94k PA,rather there would be so much liquidity now for speculative purposes since the debt market has crashed.
What are you saying bros?
You know what you need?Go Allen avenue go carry the biggest waist weh dey there commot liquid for your body,na em dey make you no dey see well

I see the angle you're viewing from. Your perspective is accurate. Just not holistic.

And you should know not to suggest pit toilet trash to a pastor.

Lazyyouth4u:

You are misquoting me o. Read my comments again please. I said government can increase taxes if they want to. This is basic. But they can’t ask people to make contributions for health insurance when they purchase goods like recharge card. I said contributions o. Not taxes. Think critically about this ridiculous idea and you will see that it is beer parlour talk that only drunk illiterates will applaud.

Please go to the NHIS website to read about how the informal sector is covered. Maybe you can reach out to them to suggest ways to improve the contributions and coverage to that segment of the population.

maishai:
Sounds like some people enjoy paying taxes in Nigeria..........As for me I don't and look for all means to evade it, for the sole reason that it would be embezzled by who knows whom

Avoid which is okay.

Evade is criminal.

Dangote avoided around 85bn in taxes in 2018 or so, he didn't evade.

TransAtlanticEx:
I am talking credit you are talking debt market?
What's the correlation?
For the fact that there is so much liquidity out there due to low tb rates,don't you see how weak the naira is?
Does that not tell you mopping up naira is also a means to strengthen the currency without intervention?
Cheap credit helps our fx position in what way?

Trans, are you in a trance?

credit = debt now?

The cheap credit helping our FX position is straight forward.

How much naira did you get buying 10m T-bills in 2018? about 1.8m

How much today for thesame 10m just 94k based on the last auction result.

so you could take that 1.8m to chase USD in2018, today your 94k exerts much lower pressure.

same with bank lending, banks that didn't want to lend at 27% in 2017 cos there was free 23% OMO, are now looking for customers at 15%.

Most large corporates are issuing s at sub 7%

When you mentioned that cheap credit may also lead to excessive consumption thereby increasing FX demand, that's almost true just that the issue there isn't the cheapness of the credit but rather easy access.

If you give 10m to someone who knows it's secured with his salary of future retirement benefits, he's more likely to first think very carefully before accepting, even if the interest is just 10% pa. And he'll eventually utilize it well if he chooses to take it.

But when you say anyone should just dial a code on their phone and they can get up to 6m instantly with no paperwork involved, that's the type that'll go into unproductive ventures like buying Benz. Even if the credit is priced at 30%.

Lazyyouth4u:

Nigeria has a national health insurance scheme. Contributions for health insurance are deducted from employee’s paychecks. Even the informal sector is covered. This is how health insurance works globally. No country mandates its citizens to make contributions at the point of purchasing goods like recharge cards. Also, no country mandates profitable companies to contribute its profits for citizens’ health insurance after the companies have paid taxes. This is 2020.

Asking as someone who wants to know, how does NHIS cover folks in the informal sector. motorists and market traders for instance.

And I think it's wrong to keep saying np country taxed people at the point of purchase of goods. I have cited an example of the gas tax in some US states. That voids that argument already.

jedisco:


In virtually every country you pay tax at the point of purchasing good and services. That tax is used by the government in funding critical infrastructure including health.

True.

Lazyouth, I learnt folks in Carlifornia, maybe several other US states pay gas tax used for maintaining their roads. The tax is added to the price per gallon folks pay at gas stations.

So when you pay $2.13 a gallon for gas, the actual gas cost which goes to Exxon and the likes may just be $2.01 the 12 cents goes to the road maintenance pool.

So you see Ahib isn't wrong afterall.

maishai:



Oga this system is dead on arrival in Nigeria, Next Common entrance examination of your kids to secondary schools...... go there and witness the legendary level of malpractice that is going on................Go to WAEC, JAMB, NECO,A-LEVEL, POST JAMB, GRADUATE AND POST GRADUATE and witness extra legendary levels of malpractice and someone is suggesting Nigerians Write exams to obtain positions of service

Kill this idea it wont work

Let Inec be like SHL , candidates apply to INEC.
INEC sends them link to take tests.

Shl will allow you write test in your home unsupervised. less than 10% or candidates still make it.

we don't have to follow the waec pattern.

The challenge I see with the suggestion is who will manage the economy at the top levels, all the years we'll wait for these successful candidates to grow from the grassroots.

Lazyyouth4u:

In what sane country do governments mandate citizens to make contributions to a healthcare fund (or any other public service) at the point of purchasing goods or services? Are people not already paying taxes? Are people not making contributions through the National Health Insurance Scheme? People must think before making such impractical comments. It’s ridiculous that anyone can even think like that in 2020!

The deduction is not a tax. it's a contribution that you own.

less than 20% of the adult population does NHIS. But more than 80% recaharge airtime on their phones.

TransAtlanticEx:
No.
So long as the people know there is a sovereign wealth for health and start seeing government structures that came from the proceeds of this trustfund and some people getting healthcare for free while others don't,they would want to benefit whether they contribute or not and if you deny them access,they will cry foul and start spinning conspiracy theories and probably disturb communal peace and spark violence.
Why create this scenario in the first place when you can simply tell them to pay their bills or die?

I think he mentioned BVN and thumbprint verification, the essence of those should be for determining how much you've contributed, thereby dictating how much can be drawn towards your healthcare cost.
the folk who thinks he's been smart by recaharging sparingly would have to augment greatly with cash at the point of care giving

TransAtlanticEx:
what now happens to abokis that recharge 50 naira a month?
Don't you see that this sovereign wealth will be benefitting some that don't contribute much at the expense of large contributors?
This is another socialist idea and must be crushed now before it even germinates
Pay your hospital bills or die,very simple.

You'll only be able to draw proportionately to your contribution.

Perhaps the advantages will be:

1. Ease of collection.

2. People can live with 10% taken off their recaharge, so it'll be good that it's going into a pool for them.

Lazyyouth4u:

Even the most insane coup plotters in a kangaroo state can never impose such a hopeless decree on companies that create jobs, pay huge taxes to the government and provide much needed services in their country. I am flabbergasted at some comments people make on this forum.

Ahib's suggestion doesn't impact MTN revenue at all.

It's not like government will fix their prices or reduce it. As long as MTN doesn't reduce their prices, theoretically, their revenue doesn't change.

Let's say they charge N10 per minute for calls, Someone making 100 minutes of calls would need N1000 airtime, so he recharges 1000.

Only difference under Ahib's new suggestion to s that the person will now have to recaharge about 1100 to get the same call time.

MTN takes their normal 1000, and push 100 to the FG on his behalf.

When MTN gets the 1100 from him, they won't even record their revenue as 1100 but still 1000 the 100 is a surcharge they have to remit. So the dough stays still at 1000.

TransAtlanticEx:
Cheap credit in a country that don't have enough fx revenues and an import dependent nation abi?
Or you don't know MPC rate is a tool used to mop up liquidity so as to diminish demand for fx and curb inflation abi?
Oshey financial expert...
Dunce.
Like the government will just stand on the mountain and say let there be cheap credit and it happens
Not knowing if you do that,you won't even have enough dollars to meet the demand of the people that will take that cheap credit and want to exchange all that naira for fx.
What a brilliant man

There was a time when foul-language was hardly seen here. You don't have to say silly names to make your points.

Now, actually, cheap credit helps our FX position than expensive ones.

That's why we're pushing near-zero rates currently. Fewer new naira gets created, ultimately, fewer naira becomes available to pursue FX.

T-bills were at 18% in 2017. Zenith Bank made 750bn gross revenue that year.

Since then, they've not been able to even reach 700bn again.

TransAtlanticEx:
Just see entitlement mentality.
Who gives a shit about the children of the poor?
Do you know if the rich kid's father was also a pauper who fought his way through life and won?
Who told you the rich are cowards?you think they are afraid of the masses?
Did you hear protesters going to banana Island or some affluent sections of Ikoyi to loot?
You think they don't wanna go there or don't know they can go there?
What they are afraid of Is the consequence of that act,because they know mean mofos are there hired by the rich with assault rifles to take any entitled fool out with no remorse.
School is not suppose to be a business?are you stupid,nigga?
Some of you people's utterances on here just shows y'all to be retarded underachievers in real life,spits mehn!

Oga, what's your stress now?

Why do you have to say "stupid"?

Did he even mention you?

If you don't like to hear other people's opinions, why not get lost already?

You'll be opening your funny mouth to utter funny words at people. That's something you should grow out of ASAP.

ultron12345:
Biko, I was recently thinking about international school business. From the little research I've done, 80% of Nigerian state capitals (apart from Lagos and Abuja) have enough wealthy people to sustain at least, 2 schools, each with 1000-1500 students charging 2.5 to 4 million per annum per student.

Can anyone else confirm this? What do you think? In your opinion, how true is it?

2.5 to 4m pa is quite much for a secondary school, especially outside lagos and Abuja.

I mean Covenant University charges less than 1m per annum, I suppose.

except if you're talking full boarding, where feeding and some other basics become your responsibility.

Even at that, 400k per term, translating to only 1.2m pa would be more like it.

a good percentage of folks in those states who can afford the bills are already past secondary school training with their kids. the millennials and generation X folks who have kids in high school are on a comparatively lower financial percentile.

There are also those who've already enrolled their kids in Lagos, Abuja Accra, etc.

Finally, there's competition to consider.

You may want to check the performance (enrollment) of schools like Faith Academy in those states versus places like Lagos and Abuja.

I'm sorry if I sound pessimistic, I don't mean to.

https://nairametrics.com/2020/10/09/fg-approves-the-establishment-of-shoe-garment-and-leather-processing-factories-worth-n5-08-billion/

This article says the minister of interior has a proposal for a PPP that'll make footwear and uniforms for the Nigerian customs service locally, maybe the Immigration service too.

They're bringing in Chinese as technical partners.

about 1300 direct jobs, and some forex savings too.

DexterousOne:



Okay
I don hear you.


Nigeria deserves a better president than this buffon we have, hence I cant go easy on the criticism
I stand by that.

Hopefully someone sensible and sound succeeds him after this term of his is over.

As for the emphasis on the line of work
I'll omit that going forward
Looking back in retrospect
I think you are right, it was not imperative I mention it.

At the end of the day
Despite what we think
I think one thing we all want is a better country
I think that's the common goal

And I know 100% that this man in Aso rock is not fit to give us that......

That said
It was a pleasure reading all the comments

Peace

I expected a harsh reply from you.

Thanks for being mature.

DexterousOne:
Nowhere in this world will you have a pseudo economic meltdown
And the govt idea of getting out of it
Is to tax the existing tax base to death

I'm all for more responsibility when it comes to Taxation
As it seems Nigerians generally are aloof and irresponsible when it comes to taxes


But not this route

But hey, they have done what they want to do

It's the mitigation we should think of

You keep talking about taxing to death. Please explain with facts and figures how that is?

Because what is common knowledge is that CIT has only be reduced to a graduated scale of between 0% and 30% unlike before when it was 30% for everyone. it's now 0% for some people and 20 or 25% for others. Only large firms still pay the old 30%. That's still not an increase.

Ahib said taxable entities have increased from around 6m in the past to around 18m now. You said it's not increasing tax base, how is it not sir?

The NIP/NEFT transfers and over the counter deposits should have a volume of around 20m daily or say 500m monthly. There're still POS transactions too, so I think the 50bn monthly figure Ahib stated is realistic. That's 600bn annually. It's a duty paid by lots of nigerians. How is that not expanding the tax base.

I do agree with your suggestions on private sector involvement though, but you should realize that sometimes talk is quite cheap, and since you've heard that these things are even already being done-the concession and increased tax revenue- you should actually go easy with your criticism on the president.

You don't have to like him, but rather than criticize, you'd help us more if you thought of things you can do on your own. Maybe develop a covid vaccine and get billions of dollars that you can sell to the CBN at 300, or anything else that'll contribute to eliminating our dependence on oil for forex.

Also, I don't think it's exactly necessary to think your line of work gives you any special insights into the running of the country. Maybe, maybe not. But I don't think you should overemphasize.

Plus saying the president's report card comes to your desk. I'm forced to ask "as who?". I mean if he is the commander in chief, what would that make someone who gets his report card?

Anyways, realize that for you to be born a Nigerian, you probably have a role to play to make life better for the people. So it shouldn't just be about complaints and eloping.

I will do agric to earn forex, contribute my quota towards stabilizing the economy. What will you do?

ultron12345:



1000 cows is even small.

There's a dairy company called Almarai in Saudi Arabia. They milk over 22 litres per day each cow, and they have 94,000 cows. They produce 1 billion litres of milk annually. They process this milk into different products. They have 38,000 staff, do $3.9B in revenue annually, with market cap of $13.1B (that is packaged Fulani herdsmen company = dangote cement x 2, or dangote cement + MTN Nigeria)

They do their dairy farming in the Saudi desert. They imported management from Ireland. Imported all their cows (modified breeds). They even had to put AC (air conditioning) in all the farm sheds for all the cattle to protect them from the harsh desert heat which can sometimes reach as high as 45C. Since they can't grow grass to feed the cattle, they bought land in Argentina and the US, grow the grass there then import them to Saudi Arabia to feed the cattle.

All this struggle and stress yet they are able to produce products that in of price are competitive in the international market, hence they also export to other countries. If it's Nigerians, they'll come up with 1000 reasons why it can never work and blame the government. Nigerians will be waiting for Dangote or indians/lebanese/chinese. If Dangote does it finally, they'll say it's monopoly. If it's Lebanese or Indian, theyll say it's money laundering.

Fonterra, a dairy cooperative owned by 10,500 farmers in New Zealand makes $12B in revenues exporting milk and other dairy products. That's 30% of the world's dairy exports, from tiny New Zealand.

Chiquita is doing $3B in revenue growing ordinary bananas in South America and selling in US. Dole does $4.5B doing same along with ordinary water melon and pineapple.

Ecuador, Philippines, Columbia, Costa Rica, Guatemala make $3.3B, $1.9, $1.6B, $1B and $1B annually from exporting ordinary banana. Ivory Coast and Cameroon get $340M and $250M from the same banana. Nigerians will be blaming government. Thank God banana is not an electricity intensive business. I wonder what excuse will be given for this. It's labour intensive and we have cheap labour, cheap land, conducive tropical climate and a weak currency, yet we can't do anything.

All these are the kind of things we need in this country, this is what will grow our economy, not coding another ride-hailing app or biscuit ordering app.

Even if we want to do tech, we should go for IT outsourcing like India, not to be coding apps that our people are too poor to use. Where we can use our massive university educated and cheap labour resources to provide labour intensive IT services to companies in the developed world. Instead of them playing Americans $60,000 per annum, they'll outsource to Nigerian companies at quarter that price. This is what TCS, Infosys, Tech Mahindra, Wipro and many others do in India. These 4 companies employ 450000 (yes, not 4,500, not 45,000 but 450,000. Four hundred and fifty thousand employees), 242000, 125000, and 175000 people respectively and made $23B, $13B, $5B and $9B in revenues respectively. Over 95% of this revenue is "exports", meaning the money came in foreign currency. And they have over 20 of such companies in India, employing in hundreds of thousands. Imagine we had just one in Nigeria. But no, it's only hotel and filling station we can build. Ordinary call center, we could not do. We had to wait for an Indian company disguised as an "African Company" to come and get BPO contracts from our Telecom companies. That Indian company is employing thousands of Nigerians across several locations today. Only in Ibadan, they have over 2000 staff at their call center. All this while Nigerians blamed the government.

As we talk about making policies for ease of business, we should also ask, making these policies for who? Because it seems Nigerians are not ready to do anything apart from blaming the government.

So sorry to digress oo, back to your post.

I don't like the idea of CBN or government owning enterprises. They should just create policies and try to make things easier. In my opinion, the CBN is really trying, one can get low interest loans through the bank of agriculture and bank of industry. CBN is now the one doing the work of ministry of agriculture.

Even if they must own farms, they should have minority stake of 40% maximum, so that the private shareholders make the decisions. Before some stupid Nigerians enter government and kill the farm by using the management positions to reward their incompetent friends and relatives.

That number employed is even 542,000 not 450k (242, 125,175k)

Look at the numerous ways we can grow our forex earnings by at least $10bn per annum.

And we're still begging world Bank for $1.5bn.

I think I'll push my retirement forward.

Let me float an agric firm.

Even it it's $10m a year, it'll be a good start.

With 1000 such other firms, we'll be talking $10bn in forex earnings.

Thanks for your beautiful insights.

ultron12345:


There is no learning curve joor. Anyone who is serious will import the necessary expatriate management and specialized manpower from India at the beginning. Then they can transfer skills to local staff. Is farming rice more complicated than manufacturing cement that Nigerian companies are doing.

These small small farmers are not the one who will move agriculture forward in Nigeria. They can't take us anywhere. We need people and corporations who are ready to do agriculture on a large scale, who can afford the necessary mechanization and processing equipment and will farm land in thousands of hectares. Those small farmers will then be employed on these large farms and be paid salaries. Only the economies of scale alone will be able to bring down costs. Someone farming on 2000 hectares will produce at a lower cost per unit than someone farming on less than half hectare. Small farmer will buy bag of fertilizer at N5000 from middlemen because he's buying in small quantities. Big farmer will buy at N3000 direct from manufacturer because he's buying in hundreds of trailers. Such large farms will more productive as they will be able to afford the necessary seeds and fertilizers and best farm practices. This will solve the problem of small Nigerian farmers yielding 1 ton per hectare when their counterparts abroad are doing 8 tons per hectare.

All these tiny 2 plot farms cannot take us anywhere. These small farms lack economies of scale, are inefficient, poorly managed and unproductive. They are one of the reasons why food is expensive.

The way we look for people to invest billions in factories is the same way we need people to invest billions in farming. Or at best, cooperatives can be formed, where a group of small farmers or just ordinary investors can pull land and funds together to form a company underwhich they will be employees earning salaries monthly and then dividends at the end of the year. This cooperative will employ proper expatriate management who will manage the farm properly. If 5000 people pull N1Million each, that is N5B. Bank loan can be taken from bank of agriculture to make it up to N12-15B. Invest all this in a single sizeable rice farm with a rice mill of good capacity, and a plant to convert the remaining bran into animal feed or bran oil. Or invest that into a single cattle or poultry farm and tell me whether your products will not be cheaper and of better quality. One can even start taking advantage of the weak currency and start exporting since such company will be able to produce to high quality standards required by developed countries. Not to expect illiterate 2 plots farmers to export yam to Europe that will be returned due to poor quality. Is it Fulani herdsmen that will export beef or milk? Can they process beef properly to EU standards? Can they pasteurize milk at ultra-high temperatures and package it aseptically?

Imagine we didn't have big cement manufacturers. Imagine we had just thousands of small households who go to the mine, use chisel and shovel to dig up limestone and other minerals. Then use wheelbarrow to carry it home. Then start using iron block to manually grind the minerals. Then mix manually, heat with firewood, then grind again, the pour into those black polythene bags or into one big basin to take to the market to sell. Imagine how wasteful and inefficient this process is. Of course, the end product will be of a higher price and lower quality than that of huge, well-organized cement plants. This is the problem of agriculture today.

Brilliant, Ve..rry Brilliant!

From Sugar to Cement, to Refinery, Dangote is often particular about building some of the largest facilities. The results of this is obvious.

Maybe Rabiu will soon become another like Him.

The CBN should look at ways of incorporating large agric firms in partnership with the private sector.

Instead of just giving hundred of billions in intervention funds. I think now will be a good time to consider creating firms that they will fund and own. Such firms would then be compelled to do agric on a large scale.

I recently saw a video where cows were milked at about 20litres a day on a farm with over 1000 cattles. I can't really the figures exactly, but I I estimated that if we had such systems, a 157ml of evaporated milk should conveniently retail below N100 with much better quality, since it will be made from fresh milk.

We can't keep waiting for Dangote, and just throwing trillions in intervention funds doesn't seem sufficient anymore. CBN should incorporate, fund and co-own mammoth agricultural companies.

ultron12345:


My brother, you have spoken well.

Where some see problems, others see opportunity. To some, the infrastructure in Nigeria is a problem, to others, it's an opportunity.

Let me use the Nigerian banking sector as an example. Today, Nigeria's banking sector is well developed, but it was not always so. Back in the 70s and 80s, it was very poor and underdeveloped. At that time, there were two sets of people.

The first set of people are like dextrousone. They were wailing and frowning and insulting the industry, calling the country a shithole for not having a well developed banking industry comparable to other countries.

The second set of people, instead of seeing the underdeveloped banking industry as a problem, saw it as an opportunity to get a strong foothold in the industry. Back then, it was very easy to start a bank due to undevelopment of the sector. Very low regulatory and capital requirements. So they took advantage of this and started bank, some collapsed while some became the banks we see today. Among this second set of people, are the likes of Tony Elumelu and Jim Ovia.

Now that the banking industry is developed, the opportunity in the industry has reduced. Very very few can meet to high and tight capital and regulatory requirements to get into the banking industry today, compared to back in those days when the industry was underdeveloped and therefore with low requirements which provided the opportunity for people like Jim and Tony. If Jim and Tony were today in the same position where they were back in those days before starting their banks, graduates with few years of working experience, of course they wouldn't be able to start UBA and Zenith Bank today. It was the underdevelopment of the industry that gave them their opportunity. Today, all the wailers, including those who used the undeveloped industry as an excuse to move abroad, are nowhere near them.

I am not saying everyone must stay in Nigeria. If you think abroad will favour you better than Nigeria, then leave. Those that believe Nigeria favours them better than abroad, will stay back. The problem I have is that those that want to leave will not allow the rest to hear word, everytime disturbing and insulting those that want to stay. If you wan go, then go in peace and leave us alone. Indians go abroad too and achieve far far more than any Nigerian diaspora can ever achieve, yet you won't hear then making useless noise or insulting their country and those who decided to stay back. As you're leaving, many are coming in, especially the Lebanese and Indians, and I can bet these people that are coming in will be far more productive and beneficial to the nation than you if you stayed. Where I leave, there's a large number of Lebanese-Nigerians who've been here for generations. Others came quite recently. I see the huge celebrations they throw when they get their Nigerian ports. So as you're celebrating your Permanent Residency or port abroad, there are also those who are celebrating getting our own down here. So as you're going, we are working towards building our own back here. Our own that we can call our own, not another person's own where I will have to be continuously chanting black lives matter, racism and I can't breathe.

So as Abroad is your paradise, Nigeria is also paradise for others. Go to your paradise and let others enjoy their paradise in peace.

Also, anti-immigrant sentiment is springing up across the developed world. Trump is only the first. Go and look at others like Matteo Salvini in Italy. That one is willing to sink any ship carrying african migrants across the Mediterranean. I hope if or when the real owners of those countries you're running to, decide to kick you out, you will not start shouting "Black Lives Matter"and racism and "I can't breathe", because they have a right chase away unwanted visitors. They also have a right to treat you as they wish, including gunning you down for no just reason. If you don't like it, they'll tell you, shut up or go back to your country.

Funny how they call and cheer and love it when Trump calls their country or continent a shithole but get angry and start calling him racist when he treats them and their kind as nothing more than "shit from a shithole"

This is what we're talking about!

Beautiful!!

ahiboilandgas:
Pls my office sec told me she invested 450k in bara/Mba ...at 17 percent per months ....how do Nigeria people reason ....she lost 300k in MMM now this that it been 3 year on ......are Nigerian normal people or just greed driven.....i tire ooh

There are those who know for sure it will fail, but hope to cash out before it does.

jedisco:
Some people are misrepresenting the currency conversion thing and are not considering the relativity which is the bedrock of the discussion. It's like comparing apples to oranges.

The fact is that even though basic items in $/£ may be more expensive when directly converted into Naira, looking at them in real , you'd see they are cheaper for those living and earning in the west. That's the advantage of having a stable currency with a high standard of living

Take certain examples.
1. Someone earning about 150-200k in Nigeria should roughly earn between £2000-3000 after tax working in a similar field abroaf. Asides rent (£350-550 or 15-25% monthly), you're likely to spend a greater percentage of your income on virtually every other aspect of living and still get a lower standard for such if you were in Nigeria.

Take food for e.g. Even if you set out to be obese, as far as u cook your food, it'd be very difficult to spend over £200-300 a month on feeding. £10-£15 would make you a full pot of stew which will include a large sized chicken, 3-4pcs of large mackerel, good quality rice + fresh vegetables/salad to go along. That pot would easily last a single person 2 weeks. Now what percentage of income has been spent about 0.5%. Someone in Nigeria would spend about 7,500 asides fuel for generator to get such which will translate to about 5% of their pay.

2. The scenario above cuts across virtually every other aspect like clothing, gadgets e.t.c. The only things relatively more expensive in the West are accomodation and cost of labour (if you're paying someone to do a job).

The same ratio would apply to fueling vehicles. Even though fuel is more expensive in Nigeria, you'd spend proportionately much more of your income fueling your vehicle than if you were in the west.

Take other examples;

3. Minimum wage in the UK is currently £8.7/hr. Most people earn more. Even if you take away tax (which they'd be paying very little if at all), a person earning that would likely live a more comfortable life than someone earning 100k in Nigeria not to talk of the 30k federal minimum wage and much lower amounts even graduates earn with states or the private sector.

The least one can get a male haircut is £10 (can easily be upto £30). Much more for a female hair do. So anyone doing any regular job, should earn enough to live life to some standard.
In Western countries, it really should be called a minimum living wage and conversely a barely surviving wage in Nigeria. Some people sit at home all day and still earn stipends from the government which are enough to cater for certain things.

More examples...
4.The chap in the UK would from his 1month pay be able to sponsor himself to a regular holiday in any part of the world. The chap in Nigeria would have to save for several months just to get a flight ticket not to talk of visa fees e.t.c
There's a reason why developed countries have the most number of travelers/tourists. Most Nigerians/Africans don't travel for leisure even within Nigeria/Africa because we cannot afford it. A return ticket to nearby Ghana is well over 100k. A return ticket from between UK and can easily be less than £50 or £100 for most parts of Europe

Same applies to phones, cars vehicles e.t.c.

Most of the used clothes, London phones and used/tokumbo (what we laughably now call brand new) cars we buy in Nigeria are items used by regular people in the West. Ask yourself why our middle class have been reduced to such if Nigeria was cheap.

What percentage of Nigerians would their total one year salary give them a recent tokumbo vehicle talk more of a new one. Someone in the west can get something similar with a few months pay and can even take a long soft loan for it.

Also, living in a developed society comes with some perks... There are always benefits to claim on certain items, you can easily get items and structure paying back over a while, most items bought new (no matter the price) are of relatively good quality because of consumer protection laws and a robust return policy, there'd always be a standard playground around where you can take kids to play for free, driving good vehicles/going on holidays/using recent gadgets all of a sudden would be regular items for you and not luxury. There's also good quality 'free' healthcare in alot of places

Like I said the only time when you may pay relatively higher is in paying for labour or accomodation. Even at that, you still get a better quality.

Accurate! Brilliant!! Beautiful!!!

Nigsrdumb:


Busted out laughing with the snake comment.

I laughed for close to 5 minutes when Ahib first wrote it.

Nigsrdumb:


Keyword here , they get caught.

Another keyword: They're restricted from entering.

If those countries trusted that their systems would be good enough to tackle those funny Nigerians, they wouldn't have to ban visa issuances to them now.

You hear of snake!!! swallowing 36m, or one person having 2500 ATM cards like having access to 2000 bank s, and you still think this situation hasn't gone beyond normal.

Developed countries are "fearing" these Nigerians, so it's in place to think it's more about the people than a government system.

ahiboilandgas:
end of discussion.......4000 Nigerian travel to dubai with over 500,000 Nigerian atm card to withdraw our foreign exchange for round tipping untill the cbn blockd cards working in middle East cos of ease of getting visa.....this group withdrawn 2 bn dollars from Nigeria reserve within 4 months.......Nigerians are not normal citizens.....one was caught with 2500 atms recently

2500 cards for one person?

Na wah!

DexterousOne:



Huh

I have nothing to say to you on this, if I have to spell out the wrong turn

No now, you can't just come and talk about a wrong turn and not tell us what it is now.

Personally, I don't appreciate the huge debts this government has amassed. it's just not healthy.

is that the wrong turn you're referring to?

DexterousOne:


This is precisely my point


When you create incentive for corruption

Corruption MUST THRIVE

I agree with you on this.

Now the CBN can only tackle the aspect that is within its reach, and that's what it's doing

ahiboilandgas:
the nepa offical are the once doing by for people for a fee ...then nepa offiials come for inspection if caught they will collect their share ....who wil enforce this Ghanaians abi.

O boy!

DexterousOne:


I wont say he is the root cause as such


But the wrong turns he took made it worse

And his refusal to listen, or address key issues

What that wrong turn? -i'm asking as wanting to know.

I don't like blame games, but i think the reserves at 2014 should have been over $100bn if previous governmentS had handled our FX resources well enough.

DexterousOne:


The bolded will lead to the collapse of the Nigerian monetary system

I how Greece started
And how they ended

Nigeria case will be the worst

Alternative channels that would be created will shock you


Addressing the root cause of this mess is the only solution

Cosmetic procedures and brute force will not cut it

I don't think the system would collapse though.

People who would hoard their dollars at home or ship them abroad are thesame ones that are currently holding them idly in Dom s. So net difference is near zero.

However there's ba good chance that a number of them would not be comfortable with those options of keeping millions at home or smuggling cash out, so they'll just give up.