NewStats: 3,263,148 , 8,179,262 topics. Date: Wednesday, 04 June 2025 at 08:39 PM 6y6g1q

nedekid:

That was what nitel said until mtn, econet came on board.
Mtn said it was impossible to do per second billing, until Glo came and they all started per second billing.
Oga, raise price of fuel to 1k per liter and you will get the same excuse why they cannot produce at that price and tell you it must be 2k!
How about asg 1 marginal oil well to each modular refinary. Extract and refine and sell to the local market? After all the oil is our natural resources. Give it to the refinary for nothing!
Anyway, if there is a will there is always a way.

Big difference between telecoms and petroluem...telecoms operators were allowed to set the price they wanted to set...which meant that they could operate at a profit, and that is why Glo even got into the market...the lure of profits.

Petrol in Nigeria is not sold at a profit but at a loss,and the subsidy paid to cover the loss is inadequate, hence the problems.

For the same problem to happen in GSM sector, government would have to set the price of a call at N1 for one hour.

backbencher:


Because you did not read the article




In other words, if you want a madular refinery, you have to let it run at a profit, and that means removing subsides, and allowing the market to control the price...ie make a profit.

Channel a fraction of the subsidy funds to modular refinery operators instead of channelling them to importers and marketers.

oyatz:


On this issues of refining, you seems to be anti- people and aligning with the Government!

U seem to be blinded by socialism that haven't worked anywhere in the world

Do u how many million family would leave the poverty line because of this ?

U know how much car owners would save on car repairs ?

backbencher:


Well, on another thread, someone commented that he bought fuel from 'illegal refinery' at a cost higher than N200.

Also government recogniton means that they have to adapt to the same standards, including environmental , to work well. Meaning they have to buy and build new facilities that meet the new standards, and maintain them,and those cost money. Meaning a rise in their cost of production, and a rise in fuel price.

(Or you want people to keep on having soot and pollution because 'cheap fuel'?)

Their fuel are extremely cheap. That's why some filling stations buy mostly from them and go to the depot to buy just some few trucks to dilute it and make maximum gains.


Yes,their recognition will call for improved standards but will not increase cost of production if the government is not selling the crude to them based on international rates.

jmoore:
Dumb reasons!!!

They can produce and export to neighboring African countries.

They can produce and the government will buy it at subsidize rates too.

It is cheaper to subsidize locally refined petrol than imported petrol.

Your last point is the banger. Cheaper to subsidize when refined locally cos the issue of logistics To and Fro would have been removed.

mrvitalis:
This is what I was saying for long people abused me

Not only that most can't even produce petrol

For what we sale fuel in Nigeria no refinery would break even in 100 years even

Fuel should sale for nothing less than 400 a litre
Not only should subsidy be removed ...#50 to #80 road tax should be imposed for fuel and #100 tax on diesel for road maintenance

You failed to mention that govt will then need to review wages as it would have effect on every commodity.

Poor people don't benefit from subsidy it's the rich n middle class that do

backbencher:


Because you did not read the article




In other words, if you want a madular refinery, you have to let it run at a profit, and that means removing subsides, and allowing the market to control the price...ie make a profit.

Where is NNPC buying PMS from at the moment? isn't it from refineries abroad and at the market price? So what stops NNPC from buying PMS from the modular refineries in NIgeria at the market price and selling to nigerians?

HarryDuce:
Well, they will have to buy the oil they're used to stealing. They will also refine using cleaner methods all of which involve money. I'm sure you're no stranger to the soot pollution in Port Harcourt and environs.

Improving standards has nothing on the price cos they make more than enough to cover for that.

Just don't sell the crude to them at the international market rate if you really want to solve this problem.

backbencher:
What the NNPC boss is saying is simple.

Modular refineries can only work when government allows petrol to be sold at market price, otherwise they won't make enough of a profit to function well otherwise.

even you yourself know that isn't true. Modular refineries don't incur extra cost of transportation that foreign refiners incurs. All the govt has to do is buy from the modular refineries and sell with or without subsidy as they have been doing with foreign refineries.

Starpro87:


Does it also mean that the much anticipated Dangote Refinery will not produce PMS, after commissioning, because of this same full price regulation?

It is now clear what the who remove Petrol Subsidy cry by the government is about.

DANGOTE and his financiers. They want to make a killing by selling it to the public at an astronomical rate, while the government officials keep the loot meant for subsidies.

TheGoodJoe:


Channel a fraction of the subsidy funds to modular refinery operators instead of channelling them to importers and marketers.

It's still the same issue.

Basically, what we have in the petrol industry is government setting price of petrol, which means that people who import or refine petrol at home cannot set their price, and run at a loss.

That affects the ability of the modular refinery to run in such a situation. A modular refinery owner can do his calculations and say he needs to set the price he sells fuel at say N300 to make a profitto pay maintenance and expansion, and staff costs, while the marketers need to sell that fuel at N380 (HYPOTHETICAL PRICES , PLEASE!)..to earn a profit to pay transporters, staff, expand facilites, etc.

But then government steps in and says PRICE OF FUEL IS N40 PER LITER! (Buhari campaigned on that you know )

So, how is the marketer going to pay all his costs, and indirectly pay refining costs.?

Subsidy...which means government pays something like N200 per liter of fuel sold, which cannot pay all the costs of the marketer, transporter and refiner effectively (that means at the end what costs N300 to make is now being sold for N240.)

And then, costs of production, transport and so on rise......(at the very least, the fuel attendant may want a raise of N20000 per liter, since she is married and has a son on the way....).

That's why fuel has to be sold at market price, not at government price, and why subsidy is bad for Nigeria (and yes, I know what would happen if we remove subsidies, but people want to make money. You and I inclusive)

CyberHustle:
even you yourself know that isn't true. Modular refineries don't incur extra cost of transportation that foreign refiners incurs. All the govt has to do is buy from the modular refineries and sell with or without subsidy as they have been doing with foreign refineries.

But they have

Maintenance costs

Upgrade costs

Staff costs (salaries don't remain static, they rise. THEY HAVE TO RISE, or you think you would pay Okoro who works at the refinery and has a wife and 4 children, with a set of twins on the way the same salary you paid him ten years ago, when he was single and first working at the place?)

Transpoort costs....(yes ).

That adds to the price, and subsides don't cover all those costs well.

backbencher:


Big difference between telecoms and petroluem...telecoms operators were allowed to set the price they wanted to set...which meant that they could operate at a profit, and that is why Glo even got into the market...the lure of profits.

Petrol in Nigeria is not sold at a profit but at a loss,and the subsidy paid to cover the loss is inadequate, hence the problems.

For the same problem to happen in GSM sector, government would have to set the price of a call at N1 for one hour.

I get you.
My reference to the telecom/GSM sector was just to show when people, companies say things cannot be done, they are always wrong as there is always a way.
I suggested asg a marginal oil well or field. One of those already drilled and capped to each of those modular refinaries to produce products for the local market.
The oil will not be given at international price. It will not be based on usd. The refinary will hence sell products as reduced price while making a very handsome margin.
Give a competent person to manage the sector and he will think out of the box.

backbencher:
What the NNPC boss is saying is simple.

Modular refineries can only work when government allows petrol to be sold at market price, otherwise they won't make enough of a profit to function well otherwise.

the man is saying rubbish.


1. The government currently pays to subsidize IMPORTED PMS, why not subsidize LOCAL production. The cost would still be lower as a lot of extra costs such as shipping and duties paid abroad are eliminated.

2. He claimed the modular refineries are not practical, yet he mentioned that some are operational in edo, and some other states. So how are those ones setting their market price?

You see that this is just nonsense talk designed for dumb people.

Ddokie:


Where is NNPC buying PMS from at the moment? isn't it from refineries abroad and at the market price? So what stops NNPC from buying PMS from the modular refineries in NIgeria at the market price and selling to nigerians?

1,Yes they buy from abroad, at some bad refineries there to keep costs down. (The refineries are in Holland and Belgium, who have standard refineries, which refine fuel at a much higher cost than at the substandard refineries...and yes, the global community does not like it because pollution)

2.NNPC can do that PROVIDED ....they can make a profit doing so, and that's why subsidies won't work in such an environment..since subsidies means that government sets the price, which is below the market price. If NNPC cannot make a profit doing so, they would be broke.

Plus PIB won't let them subsidsie eventually.

backbencher:


Big difference between telecoms and petroluem...telecoms operators were allowed to set the price they wanted to set...which meant that they could operate at a profit, and that is why Glo even got into the market...the lure of profits.

Petrol in Nigeria is not sold at a profit but at a loss,and the subsidy paid to cover the loss is inadequate, hence the problems.

For the same problem to happen in GSM sector, government would have to set the price of a call at N1 for one hour.

Stop lying. The govt buys for the sole purpose of selling at a loss(that is subsidy). Nobody is making a loss in the real sense. It is just a matter of buying from local refiners before selling to Nigerians at a lower rate. That isn't called a loss. It is still our collective wealth being used to subsidize the petrol.

Another lie again

mrvitalis:

U seem to be blinded by socialism that haven't worked anywhere in the world

Do u how many million family would leave the poverty line because of this ?

U know how much car owners would save on car repairs ?

No, I am an entrepreneur and more of a capitalist than socialist.

I just observed the unusual stand of yours

backbencher:


It's still the same issue.

Basically, what we have in the petrol industry is government setting price of petrol, which means that people who import or refine petrol at home cannot set their price, and run at a loss.

That affects the ability of the modular refinery to run in such a situation. A modular refinery owner can do his calculations and say he needs to set the price he sells fuel at say N300 to make a profitto pay maintenance and expansion, and staff costs, while the marketers need to sell that fuel at N380 (HYPOTHETICAL PRICES , PLEASE!)..to earn a profit to pay transporters, staff, expand facilites, etc.

But then government steps in and says PRICE OF FUEL IS N40 PER LITER! (Buhari campaigned on that you know )

So, how is the marketer going to pay all his costs, and indirectly pay refining costs.?

Subsidy...which means government pays something like N200 per liter of fuel sold, which cannot pay all the costs of the marketer, transporter and refiner effectively (that means at the end what costs N300 to make is now being sold for N240.)

And then, costs of production, transport and so on rise......(at the very least, the fuel attendant may want a raise of N20000 per liter, since she is married and has a son on the way....).

That's why fuel has to be sold at market price, not at government price, and why subsidy is bad for Nigeria (and yes, I know what would happen if we remove subsidies, but people want to make money. You and I inclusive)

All this one is long story. If government can buy from foreign refineries at the price the foreign refineries set it.

This also means paying for landing cost.

They can not tell me it is not cheaper for the modular refineries to set their price which will definitely be at a cheaper rate and sell it to the masses subsidized.

The modular refineries make profit and Government get the product cheaper.

backbencher:


But they have

Maintenance costs

Upgrade costs

Staff costs (salaries don't remain static, they rise. THEY HAVE TO RISE, or you think you would pay Okoro who works at the refinery and has a wife and 4 children, with a set of twins on the way the same salary you paid him ten years ago, when he was single and first working at the place?)

Transpoort costs....(yes ).

That adds to the price, and subsides don't cover all those costs well.

You lots are just jokers.

Assign just two OML to these modular refineries to produce and sell to the local market for one year and see for yourselves that you're not ready to develop this country.

TheGoodJoe:


Channel a fraction of the subsidy funds to modular refinery operators instead of channelling them to importers and marketers.

thank you jare. Some nairalanders are daft. I dont understand how they think the man is making sense. The cost of importing fuel is too much, apart from subsidy, we are paying international duties from countries it is coming from, we are also paying for the shipping and a lot of logistics costs. Why not use subsidy money to local production.

Thank you for asking the needed question.

Alexgeneration:

Their fuel are extremely cheap. That's why some filling stations buy mostly from them and go to the depot to buy just some few trucks to dilute it and make maximum gains.


Yes,their recognition will call for improved standards but will not increase cost of production if the government is not selling the crude to them based on international rates.

Ye are being too too optimistic.

A standard refinery costs more than Chukwu and Nnadozie's illicit operation in the bush. If Chukwu and Nnadozie got government recognition, they would have to shell out lots of money to upgrade...which will be ed on to their consumers.

Alexgeneration:
You lots are just jokers.

Assign just two OML to these modular refineries to produce and sell to the local market for one year and see for yourselves that you're not ready to develop this country.

Good afternoon. I don't continue to engage people who abuse me

TheGoodJoe:

All this one is long story. If government can buy from foreign refineries at the price the foreign refineries set it.

This also means paying for landing cost.

They can not tell me it is not cheaper for the modular refineries to set their price which will definitely be at a cheaper rate and sell it to the masses subsidized.

The modular refineries make profit and Government get the product cheaper.

thanks again. That fellow called backbenchers obviously ain't thinking straight at all. He is talking as if the imported fuel is supplied free of charge.

backbencher:


But they have

Maintenance costs

Upgrade costs

Staff costs (salaries don't remain static, they rise. THEY HAVE TO RISE, or you think you would pay Okoro who works at the refinery and has a wife and 4 children, with a set of twins on the way the same salary you paid him ten years ago, when he was single and first working at the place?)

Transpoort costs....(yes ).

That adds to the price, and subsides don't cover all those costs well.

you are so funny. Foreign refiners pay more and incur more production cost. What's your point exactly?

backbencher:


Good afternoon. I don't continue to engage people who abuse me

he did not abuse you. You are indeed a joker.

TheGoodJoe:

All this one is long story. If government can buy from foreign refineries at the price the foreign refineries set it.

This also means paying for landing cost.

They can not tell me it is not cheaper for the modular refineries to set their price which will definitely be at a cheaper rate and sell it to the masses subsidized.

The modular refineries make profit and Government get the product cheaper.

Well, we just don't buy from standard foreign refineries. We buy from (by EU standards) substandard, which helps keep subsidy costs and import costs low. (If we bought from standard refineries, we would be buying fuel above N400 per liter, even with subsidy).

There is an article in the UK GUARDIAN on the matter....link here

Also, domestic refining does not mean fuel below N200. Niger has a domestic refinery, which is supplied from crude oil from a domestic well (not imported) and they sell fuel at N350 a liter there. Costs of business , salaries, transporter's costs, etc

CyberHustle:

Stop lying. The govt buys for the sole purpose of selling at a loss(that is subsidy). Nobody is making a loss in the real sense. It is just a matter of buying from local refiners before selling to Nigerians at a lower rate. That isn't called a loss. It is still our collective wealth being used to subsidize the petrol.

Thanks for calling me a liar, and do have a good day. Can't argue with that.

backbencher:


Ye are being too too optimistic.

A standard refinery costs more than Chukwu and Nnadozie's illicit operation in the bush. If Chukwu and Nnadozie got government recognition, they would have to shell out lots of money to upgrade...which will be ed on to their consumers.

Buhari gave out $1 million of our money to Afghanistan and you're here giving me reasons why we cannot do what it takes to develop this country .

You're paying millions to refine outside, we say pay the same millions to refine here and you begin to reel out excuses.

Later when people cuss and hate on this country, you lots begin to mouth Patriotism like it's going out of fashion.

HardMirror:
the man is saying rubbish.


1. The government currently pays to subsidize IMPORTED PMS, why not subsidize LOCAL production. The cost would still be lower as a lot of extra costs such as shipping and duties paid abroad are eliminated.

2. He claimed the modular refineries are not practical, yet he mentioned that some are operational in edo, and some other states. So how are those ones setting their market price?

You see that this is just nonsense talk designed for dumb people.

Yes, but if you want more, you have to let them operate at a profit.

And I bid you adieu. I can't engage with people who are abusive. Cherrio.

backbencher:


Ye are being too too optimistic.

A standard refinery costs more than Chukwu and Nnadozie's illicit operation in the bush. If Chukwu and Nnadozie got government recognition, they would have to shell out lots of money to upgrade...which will be ed on to their consumers.

we are talking about standard modular refineries. They are not built to have return on investment in few months. Even if the cost is $100million, there are lots of businessmen that are ready to put their money down for the long term haul. You think telecoms is also cheap? Same thing can be done in the petroleum industry

CyberHustle:
even you yourself know that isn't true. Modular refineries don't incur extra cost of transportation that foreign refiners incurs. All the govt has to do is buy from the modular refineries and sell with or without subsidy as they have been doing with foreign refineries.

Without subsidy, transporters would be free to set cost of transporting fuel, same as we do for food, etc.